Post by: Forth Bridges on January 24, 2007, 04:44:50 pm
are you having one this year anyone?
in Scotland's Prison are taking the goverment to court to be able to vote, ( Uk is one of the last county to still not allow prison to vote)
if there don;t there might get compersanion to a tune a £1000!
Post by: smurfboy on January 24, 2007, 07:16:21 pm
Post by: Forth Bridges on January 24, 2007, 07:30:38 pm
were last to get round to it!
Post by: oldspice on January 24, 2007, 08:04:28 pm
Post by: Forth Bridges on January 24, 2007, 08:14:20 pm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/6294973.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4316148.stm
if there were smart enough there could all vote for a crime + canadate¬
Post by: Velvet Darkness on January 24, 2007, 09:52:48 pm
It seems that some people have forgotten that you're supposed to go to jail to be punished for your crimes against the other members of society and the crown. You are supposed to lose your freedom, your privileges and your right to vote when you break the law and are sent to prison.
I know that it is not a pleasant place, but it isn't supposed to be is it? The thought of it is supposed to put criminals off the idea of commiting crimes isn't it? I suppose I am old fashioned but jail just doesn't seem to mean what it used to. I have heard of prison cells with TV's and menu's for mealtimes and conjugal visits and all kinds of other things that somehow don't seem quite in keeping.
And on the news tonight judges are being advised to only give custodial sentences to the worst offenders, as the crowding in the prisons is so severe already!!!!
Why don't we just hand them all sets of keys to our houses and a list of times we'll be out? I find all this so dis-heartening, it's almost as if in the not too distant future they'll be locking up all the law abiding citizens to keep them safe from the criminals!!
Perhaps a better idea would be........ Has anyone else seen the movie Escape From New York, where the whole of New York City has been converted into an enormous prison with a huge wall and massive gates with guards and the criminals are all just left to get on with it?
Post by: Forth Bridges on January 24, 2007, 10:45:18 pm
Post by: oldspice on January 25, 2007, 07:00:05 am
I visit a local prison that is privately run (to carry out teaching assessments on the teaching staff) and I can assure you it's no picnic.
Prisoners are locked up for a long period of the day and have access to TV on a very limited scale. No Playstations are allowed. Mnay of the prisoners have to attend education classes as part of their rehabilitation plan and a lot of trouble is taken over providing them with courses and counselling to try to ensure they do no re-offend.
Only a few prisoners have luxuries such as TV in their rooms. This is limited to those serving very long terms and even then they can't watch it all day.
I agree that prison should be harsh but mainly directed towards addressing offending behaviour rather than punishing offenders to the extreme. After all, we want them to integrate back into society and if that society is too hostile they will carry on offending.
Post by: Velvet Darkness on January 25, 2007, 03:31:41 pm
I thought prison was supposed to be so bad that it acts as a deterrent towards further bad behaviour, and although educating the detainees is obviously an excellent idea as it gives them the choice of another road to take when they are released, I find it offensive that the criminals are given all these opportunities and counselling????? when those they have offended against are given nothing but a crime number and a load of excuses!
Only a few prisoners have luxuries such as TV in their rooms. This is limited to those serving very long terms and even then they can't watch it all day.
I may be wrong but I thought that the people in prison for the longest time were the ones who had either done the worst crimes or had habitually broken the law? So we are rewarding these people by giving them TV's in their rooms? Am I the only person who sees something wrong here?
I am very fortunate to have never been the victim of this kind of serious crime but I know people who have, some of them frail old people who have virtually nothing to begin with. They have been made prisoners by fear and the criminals are the ones receiving counselling?
This situation is just wrong.
Post by: kevvosa on January 25, 2007, 06:16:36 pm
I'm not defending them or their actions but saying that this is probably the reason they receive counselling. On the surface to most of us it would seem ridiculous that criminals receive counselling (just as school bullies often receive counselling) but it's done for a reason - to try and stop them repeating their crimes, nip it in the bud so to speak.
Post by: smurfboy on January 25, 2007, 07:28:10 pm
Exactly - if we don't try and find out why people commit these crimes, what hope do we have of stopping them in the future?
Post by: oldspice on January 25, 2007, 07:55:20 pm
Post by: Velvet Darkness on January 26, 2007, 12:00:27 am
And while the government spends a fortune counselling the bullies the victims are treated with indifference and worse.
Also victims of child abuse and paedophilia use that as an excuse for all kinds of obscene behaviour, it is disgusting!
I am sick of listening to them whining about how the fact that they were abused as a child made them behave that way towards their own children or, even worse, other peoples children.
It is rubbish, they are simply looking for an excuse for their behaviour that makes others believe that they are not responsible for their actions.
Child abusers are entirely to blame for their actions, they know what they are doing and the fact that they were abused themselves as a child is no excuse. It should make them even more determined NOT to behave that way as they know what it feels like.
Post by: oldspice on January 26, 2007, 06:48:42 am
Post by: kevvosa on January 26, 2007, 08:26:08 am
And while the government spends a fortune counselling the bullies the victims are treated with indifference and worse.
Who says they spend a fortune counselling them? Counselling is, like I said, to understand why they commit crimes and to try and stop it happening again. How can that be a bad thing? Obviously it's more important for the victims to get counselling, and from what I know many victims of crime do get counselling (there's a lot of organisations apart from the NHS who offer free counselling).
Post by: Velvet Darkness on January 26, 2007, 12:44:21 pm
I was not talking about school bullies the original post was about people in prison.
My point was that whilst the criminals of every sort have prison social workers falling over themselves to get them counselling the victims are left to get their own help and if they don't feel up to it they fall through the gaps, no-one helps them. And Paedophilia was mentioned in one of your posts so my response to that was not un-warranted.
School bullying is a whole different matter.
My eldest daughter is the victim of a nasty little charmer at school at the moment and she was attacked and pushed down some stairs only last week, when she defended herself by hitting the girl and telling her to leave her alone or she'd hit her again, my daughter was given detention for getting into a fight!!! For sticking up for herself in an effort to put an end to this matter that the teachers will do nothing about, she is punished!
It would seem that society today supports the criminal and ignores the victims whatever sphere you move in.
Post by: oldspice on January 26, 2007, 02:03:35 pm
Post by: kevvosa on January 26, 2007, 02:07:01 pm
What I was saying was that victims of a paedophile turned to crime themselves. They need counselling to prevent re-offending. I'm not saying that any excuse justifies their actions and I'm certainly not sticking up for them, but if it reduces crime, I support it.And Paedophilia was mentioned in one of your posts so my response to that was not un-warranted.
It would seem that society today supports the criminal and ignores the victims whatever sphere you move in.
I do agree with this. Friends of mine have had to suffer abuse from chavs simply because if they try fight back, they'll either get:
a) their windows put out by members of their gang
b) the police round
But if you report them to the police, god help you. You will probably wake up to a house full of smashed windows.
Post by: Velvet Darkness on January 26, 2007, 02:15:47 pm
But if you report them to the police, god help you. You will probably wake up to a house full of smashed windows.
Oh tell me about it, it's awful isn't it? You can either put up with being a victim of a small crime or report it and then start a vendetta that just escalates!
Where we used to live before we moved down here there was a set of old people's bungalows just across the road, and one little old dear (she was a super lady) was having her pension removed by force through threats and vandalism, every week, by one of the little heroes that lived on the estate above. He used to bray on her windows in the middle of the night every night and phone her in the early hours of the morning and threaten her until she pushed her pension through the letter box for him.
I just cannot think of the words to describe people as low as this.